Covid Recovered Providers?

[SubClubKid81]

Does knowing a provider is recovered from Covid and therefore more likely temporarily immune make you more interested in using them?

That is how I am feeling about it right now.

[Black5uperman]

Does knowing a provider is recovered from Covid and therefore more likely temporarily immune make you more interested in using them?

That is how I am feeling about it right now.

Having COVID doesn't make you immune. Yes your less likely to get it again and can fight it better but immune isn't a true statement lol.

[britttany_love]

You are definitely not immune as I know 2 people who recovered only to get exposed again. There are new strains popping up and a shitty vaccine roll out. I wouldn't let your guard down thinking you aren't still at risk.

[mathguy]

Yea you could get it again but it's not incredibly likely IMO.

What many people don't realize is how quickly viruses mutate; but almost entirely innocuously. There are currently thousands of variants SARS-COV-2. It wouldn't make for hyperbolic, extravagant, grandiose, or scary news to show such information. And the fact is many investigative journalists & the anchors simply don't have the background to understand this stuff so they focus on one little study or sound bite they heard somewhere & that spreads like wildfire in today's world causing panic about "super strains".

Nextstrain Teams Genomic Epidemiology of SARS-COV-2



So, as of today there are nearly 4,000 genomic samples with various nucleotide mutations.

The hoopla around the recent strains, so called "super strains", like the UK variant, are simply 1-2 of those 3931 genomes in the Nextstrain global DB.

Basically those are a couple of strains which have picked up some nucleotide mutations which allow them to be more infectious/transmittable (one is ~50% more). However, they are NOT more virulent. I repeat, they are NOT more deadly or cause any observable worsened symptoms. The concern is mainly with "viral spread" on that front. Yet, again, the reality is a large majority of people need to or will get it at one point and create antibodies (vaccine or otherwise).

Yes, the current vaccines work for these new virus mutations. The reasons for that get into a bunch of complex biochemical & metabolic processes but essentially what happens is the mutated viral strains (like the 3931 in Nextstrain db: which includes the so called "super strains" too) are simply not mutated enough that the antibodies won't recognize the binding site receptor on the cell and so it will 'attack' them just the same (basically whether you got any one of these 3931 variants above).

Viruses mutate often particularly RNA based viruses like SARS-COV-2. Unlike DNA genomes RNA based genomes (most viruses) mutate much more quickly than DNA because the double helix stranded form of DNA has more "error protection" while copying itself for new cells. RNA does not and therefore when creating new copies of itself it can make mistakes much more often and this is where you find a slight difference in the genome and a nucleotide base (or bases) that changed (that's why we now have technically ~4000 different genomes of SARS-COV-2 - many of which are literally one nucleotide change in the ~29,000 base pairs nucleotide genome of SARS-2).

Most of these changes are disadvantageous or neutral and small modifications to a single nucleotide or two. They do little to nothing or even have a negative effect. And they are still so similar to the others, for all intents and purposes they might as well be the same virus.

Most people who have been infected more than once very likely have come into contact with multiple of these 3931 strains and one or two of those strains just happens to have a very slightly different genome, enough that the viral envelope and binding structure is different enough that antibodies can't attach to the cell membrane b/c the protein receptors don't match.

I think these are going to be very rare cases overall. I do not expect that most people will ever get the virus again b/c the nucleotide structure and the binding site protein structure at the cell membrane are going to be virtually identical in almost all variants (or close enough that antibody immunoglobulins will be able to attach to the infected membrane/viral envelope cell).

[SubClubKid81]

Right, and I have had family that had it, and they said the Doctors told them they were immune for 3 months. A BBC article i read said that research is showing that to be at least 6 months now.

That makes me think that if a provided had it recently it would be better to go with them, than one that didn't as it would be less likely to spread it to me.

Yea you could get it again but it's not incredibly likely IMO.

What many people don't realize is how quickly viruses mutate; but almost entirely innocuously. There are currently thousands of variants SARS-COV-2. It wouldn't make for hyperbolic, extravagant, grandiose, or scary news to show such information. And the fact is many investigative journalists & the anchors simply don't have the background to understand this stuff so they focus on one little study or sound bite they heard somewhere & that spreads like wildfire in today's world causing panic about "super strains".

Nextstrain Teams Genomic Epidemiology of SARS-COV-2



So, as of today there are nearly 4,000 genomic samples with various nucleotide mutations.

The hoopla around the recent strains, so called "super strains", like the UK variant, are simply 1-2 of those 3931 genomes in the Nextstrain global DB.

Basically those are a couple of strains which have picked up some nucleotide mutations which allow them to be more infectious/transmittable (one is ~50% more). However, they are NOT more virulent. I repeat, they are NOT more deadly or cause any observable worsened symptoms. The concern is mainly with "viral spread" on that front. Yet, again, the reality is a large majority of people need to or will get it at one point and create antibodies (vaccine or otherwise).

Yes, the current vaccines work for these new virus mutations. The reasons for that get into a bunch of complex biochemical & metabolic processes but essentially what happens is the mutated viral strains (like the 3931 in Nextstrain db: which includes the so called "super strains" too) are simply not mutated enough that the antibodies won't recognize the binding site receptor on the cell and so it will 'attack' them just the same (basically whether you got any one of these 3931 variants above).

Viruses mutate often particularly RNA based viruses like SARS-COV-2. Unlike DNA genomes RNA based genomes (most viruses) mutate much more quickly than DNA because the double helix stranded form of DNA has more "error protection" while copying itself for new cells. RNA does not and therefore when creating new copies of itself it can make mistakes much more often and this is where you find a slight difference in the genome and a nucleotide base (or bases) that changed (that's why we now have technically ~4000 different genomes of SARS-COV-2 - many of which are literally one nucleotide change in the ~29,000 base pairs nucleotide genome of SARS-2).

Most of these changes are disadvantageous or neutral and small modifications to a single nucleotide or two. They do little to nothing or even have a negative effect. And they are still so similar to the others, for all intents and purposes they might as well be the same virus.

Most people who have been infected more than once very likely have come into contact with multiple of these 3931 strains and one or two of those strains just happens to have a very slightly different genome, enough that the viral envelope and binding structure is different enough that antibodies can't attach to the cell membrane b/c the protein receptors don't match.

I think these are going to be very rare cases overall. I do not expect that most people will ever get the virus again b/c the nucleotide structure and the binding site protein structure at the cell membrane are going to be virtually identical in almost all variants (or close enough that antibody immunoglobulins will be able to attach to the infected membrane/viral envelope cell).

[Sue Nami]

I had it. i have been recovered about 10 weeks now

[mathguy]

Right, and I have had family that had it, and they said the Doctors told them they were immune for 3 months. A BBC article i read said that research is showing that to be at least 6 months now.

That makes me think that if a provided had it recently it would be better to go with them, than one that didn't as it would be less likely to spread it to me.

Yea, and unfortunately one of the only things to determine with absolute certainty the length of any inoculation or immunity window is to have some time pass. We can also study the results of antibodies along with the mutation rates of the organism to determine how much it changes. This could indicate how long or effective our built up immunoglobulins (antibodies) will be good for an immunity if the virus isn't changing drastically.

Mutation rate is one of THE most critical things to look at when talking about either antibody efficacy & length of inoculation.

The good news is that SARS-COV-2 is a relatively stable slow mutating virus relative other viruses (influenza mutates 3-4 times as quickly as SARS-COV-2 & it's shorter by half).

The image I linked up above earlier is just the Nextstrain DB. There are actually at least 50,000+ known global mutations of SARS-COV-2 ^{[1 - ref link]}.

SARS-COV-2 has a mutation rate of only ~1.12 x 10^(-3) substitutions per (s/n/c).
Link you might want to read:
Slow rate of viral development and innocuous changes.

If you take any two mutated samples of SARS-COV-2 from anywhere in the world you find only between 4-10 (the average is 7.5) nucleotide differences among 29,000 base pairs that make up the entire genome. That is to say, as is the case with most organisms, mutation is rarely advantageous, in fact it's usually a disadvantage (to the organism/virus), or neutral; most of the genes doing nothing at all in the mutation of SARS-COV-2.

All of this means it is very unlikely that mutations occurring within the SARS-COV-2 genome are going to actually do anything significant or affect our built up immunity.

The main reason the couple that have been mentioned have come up is not that they are more virulent. What happened is the mutation created a gene that codes for a stronger spike protein that confers easier entry to host cells (inside you - the human - i.e. potentially more transmissible but that's about it, no other effects).

[SubClubKid81]

I had it. i have been recovered about 10 weeks now

Exactly, Sue which is one of the reasons we've been talking, but I'm also surprised that no one else has mentioned it considering we've hit stage 5 in this city and I figured it would be a potential thing to bring up right now.

[SabWolf]

I haven't had covid yet and haven't thought to ever mention it, I take precautions and also eat healthy and take vitamins. But I'm also usually home, I've supposedly been exposed a few times since last March and would quarantine but haven't had any symptoms unless they were so mild I've mistaken them for allergies. But if I'm not feeling well, I will reschedule clients.

[Ivy de la Courte]

I agree with everyone else about mutations being a factor. Also, how are you determining if someone "has" or "had" COVID and how long would you consider that lessened immunity to last before you stop seeing them? I think it's important to keep up with the changing information but when it comes down to it you are taking a risk by seeing someone either way.

I am lucky (unlucky as it's because of underlying health problems) enough that I will be getting my final dose of the vaccine next week. I will still be limiting the number of clients I see and my interactions in my personal life but it does give me some peace of mind to know that I will have it. Stay safe everyone!

[Phoenixx]

I think it's important to keep up with the changing information but when it comes down to it you are taking a risk by seeing someone either way.

Mmm hmm...