Ellen-Originally Posted by Austin Ellen
Menu can be a misnomer, however one item I have noticed is that ads contain come see me I am GFE without any mention of donation for time. I have used the term "menu" incorrectly to inquire about the donation since I couldn't find it. While this is not the case with youI think the take away may be to clearly post ones expected donation for one's time.
DragonX
On hobby hiatus.
The problem without having a menu is , any lady can say they're gfe, but their definition of gfe is waaaay different than yours.
She may only be cbj no dfk only missionary cfs.
To many ladies ,gfe means only. She's agreeing to have sex that's all.
Yes , you have the option to turn down the appt. Some may want a cancellation fee or you may risk having an alert put out on you. Or you may not find out what's available till the session is in full swing and naked with a hard dick.
Easier and less bullshit if menu is posted upfront and we can look elsewhere without even having to bother you or book with a reasonable expectation of what to expect.
Barring any hygiene issues, disrespect or roughness on our part.
Last edited by knottyman; 10-16-2018 at 04:12 PM. Reason: spelling
Amen baby girl!
True gfe is based on chemestry and a genuine connection - not how many positions you can do in an hour.If you want the TL;DR version of my posts (yes I'm a loquacious long winded dude - fuck ya if you don't like it LOL
) then just read this perfect post by kitty
Well said. There is a significant difference between those that market GFE and those that embrace it. I choose the latter.
I don't disagree necessarily but I think the main point was that the nature of true GFE means you need to leave 'business like' talk out and a menu sounds like you are ordering a hamburger as Ellen had mentioned.
The problem with true GFE is that it's hard to get on the first experience. First of all sex with anyone, private life, hobby, whatever, the first time, can be awkward anyway. It can. Sometimes no. When that happens you have hit a jackpot (both of you) whether it's hobbying or your "private life".
I do agree that for men who just want the mechanics of certain activities (that's not me btw) then yea a menu might be helpful. You can always ask. You should talk to a provider anyway. More than just hey can I come fuck you at 2pm. That's fucked up. I wouldn't do that in my private life and won't do it as a hobby either.
I would say if you are one of those men who just define gfe as a strict menu of activities tben just ask the girl. Oh and do it as polite as fucking possible too. Dont be a fucking doucjebag before you even knkw the girl and ask if you can cum in her mouth. Jesus. I cant believe some guys. Wtf is wrong with yall (if you are doing that I mean -- bc Ive heard those stories -- not pointing fingers but I've heard them).
Come on guys. Do i have to teach a class on this? What is the most obvious polite (as polite as one can expect when asking a complete stranger you have never spoken to about sex)?
Obviously don't say can I do x, y, z to you? Especially if you have nerver talked to them and don't even know them or what they like. Even as a guy would you like a txt out of the blue while you are with your kids at the park saying, "hey I'm sarah....i saw that ur a guy who will pleasure women and I'm really horny and needy right now, but I need to know if you will let me piss on ur face..."?!?? No! You wouldn't. Imagine how a woman feels. Its spine tingling at very best and vomit worthy at worst. Be a human being. Unless you already know her, talk to her, know she likes to play like that with u, etc...
Otherwise if you simply have to ask about a "menu" just say, "Hi hun, I saw ur ad. Do u mind if I ask about your physical limits, things u just don't feel comfortable with? I want to make sure bc i want u to feel comfortable with me. I hope I'm not being too forward or commiting a horrible faux paux by asking. Pls forgive me if so."
It's really not that hard to be a decent person. Just because someone is accepting payment for sex doesn't mean they aren't a human. You do realize that many of the girls you pick up at the club are just the same right? That's still paying for it. Just without a very direct route. At least this is far more of an "honest" exchange. Just my 2 cents. Or maybe 50 cents.
Note: Im not directing any comments at the quoted person. I just want to be clear. I wasn't being negative toward you personally whatsoever. I was talking to the broader audience bc I have heard some things guys do that is just unbelievable to me regarding menus, approaching women, etc... Smh.
i can totally respect your vie of the hobby. but just like gfe we all have different views of it.I don't disagree necessarily but I think the main point was that the nature of true GFE means you need to leave 'business like' talk out and a menu sounds like you are ordering a hamburger as Ellen had mentioned.
The problem with true GFE is that it's hard to get on the first experience. First of all sex with anyone, private life, hobby, whatever, the first time, can be awkward anyway. It can. Sometimes no. When that happens you have hit a jackpot (both of you) whether it's hobbying or your "private life".
I do agree that for men who just want the mechanics of certain activities (that's not me btw) then yea a menu might be helpful. You can always ask. You should talk to a provider anyway. More than just hey can I come fuck you at 2pm. That's fucked up. I wouldn't do that in my private life and won't do it as a hobby either.
I would say if you are one of those men who just define gfe as a strict menu of activities tben just ask the girl. Oh and do it as polite as fucking possible too. Dont be a fucking doucjebag before you even knkw the girl and ask if you can cum in her mouth. Jesus. I cant believe some guys. Wtf is wrong with yall (if you are doing that I mean -- bc Ive heard those stories -- not pointing fingers but I've heard them).
Come on guys. Do i have to teach a class on this? What is the most obvious polite (as polite as one can expect when asking a complete stranger you have never spoken to about sex)?
Obviously don't say can I do x, y, z to you? Especially if you have nerver talked to them and don't even know them or what they like. Even as a guy would you like a txt out of the blue while you are with your kids at the park saying, "hey I'm sarah....i saw that ur a guy who will pleasure women and I'm really horny and needy right now, but I need to know if you will let me piss on ur face..."?!?? No! You wouldn't. Imagine how a woman feels. Its spine tingling at very best and vomit worthy at worst. Be a human being. Unless you already know her, talk to her, know she likes to play like that with u, etc...
Otherwise if you simply have to ask about a "menu" just say, "Hi hun, I saw ur ad. Do u mind if I ask about your physical limits, things u just don't feel comfortable with? I want to make sure bc i want u to feel comfortable with me. I hope I'm not being too forward or commiting a horrible faux paux by asking. Pls forgive me if so."
It's really not that hard to be a decent person. Just because someone is accepting payment for sex doesn't mean they aren't a human. You do realize that many of the girls you pick up at the club are just the same right? That's still paying for it. Just without a very direct route. At least this is far more of an "honest" exchange. Just my 2 cents. Or maybe 50 cents.
Note: Im not directing any comments at the quoted person. I just want to be clear. I wasn't being negative toward you personally whatsoever. I was talking to the broader audience bc I have heard some things guys do that is just unbelievable to me regarding menus, approaching women, etc... Smh.
youre right that were not orderind a hamburger. but if im paying $200 or more. you can damn well bet im gonna ask what comes with that burger. i would never ask it so crudely which is why you ask for a menu and let them tell you hat they do and figure out what they dont do by omission.
whether you phrase as "what are your physical limits or what are you not comfortable with" youre still asking for their "menu" albeit slightly more politely. either way if she doesnt like to mention what she offers youre gonna get the same response.
most in the hobby know you dont text outta the blue someone youve never met unless she says to specifically contact her that way. we understand discreteness. most will PM 1st so she can see it at her conveinience and respond as well.
i can respect Ellens view as well as KBF too. and if they were the ONLY ladies in the hobby there prbably would even have this thread. but the fact is, they cant speak for every lady on this board. so every lady has the right to decide what gfe means to her and therefore requiring guys to ask before spending their hard earned cash.
i have to work long hrs to afford to hobby. i work in the Texas heat in the summer and the brutallly cold days of winter. when i do hobby, i dont do it frivolously. there are certain things i want in a date as do every single one of us, including you. it may not be the same as mine and it sounds like your level of gfe requirements are a lil lower than mine. Even so, do you not want to know if she offers what you want or would you prefer to find out after youre behind closed doors that she doesnt do what you considered GFE.
however you phrase it asking a lady what she will and wont do or allow, IS asking her menu.
i hope this doesnt come off as snarky just trying to answer the points that you made and why i feel a menu is important.
the ladies here are selling a product (their bodies) and a service (use of that body). i know they say theyre just selling their time. but go spend $200 dollars and have her NOT perform one sexual act and see ho long guys will still see her
I have to mention again this is pay for play. We ladies are offering up a service and an experience for a certain amount of money. So yes I believe listing atleast your do's and dont's is an imperative part of this business. I list mine because I dont want someone contacting me expecting one thing and getting the other. I also dont want to be mid date and asked or have someone try something I'm not cool with killing the mood and making things awkward. I wouldn't classify it as a menu but an open announcement of things that I do not enjoy in my private time while also allowing you to see what I do enjoy. Having it laid out stops me from having to answer the dreaded do you do this or that emails. It also allows a guy who might be looking for something in particular a chance to move on if he sees I don't enjoy something.
We are talking about hobby GFE not the type of GFE experience you would get with a real world partner both are totally different and some seem to expect that same type of experience with a professional. You most definitely do things with the a spouse or partner that you most definitely would not do with a random provider/hobbyist. It's called IOP, that's why many are so good at what they do. If you are a provider and say you're a true GFE with every single client you've ever met you would be fooling yourself. Yes you maybe have rocked their world, shown some amazing IOP and given them the typical gfe type services but you know your werent physically into every single guy you have met bcd. It happens to all of us we all have tastes etc and things that do it for us and that's not met in every encounter. Now yes you can have a great connection with a good regular or two that you have seen for a long time but this again is something that is built with time and is not the same type of connection you get with someone you just met.
Real passion and emotion does not happen with a stranger, someone you've seen 3 times for an hour and especially not when there is money envolved. If you believe that reach out to a provider you've been seeing and as her to go bcd without compensation. The money is and will always be a part of the arrangement.
True GFE is what you get with your SO this is hobby GFE. It will always be somewhat business like. You have to reach out for an appointment, figure out your schedules, schedule an incall or outcall, decided on the type and length of date and then the transaction part. This is part of this business and sorry but there is no way around it.
Respect goes a long way and do believe there is a certain way to approach and contact a provider. If you've never met then be proper and respectful, follow the proper procedure and save the rest for bcd. I've had clients that come wanting to do x, y and z and then I have had some who just like to go with the flow. Both sessions are enjoyable to me and it doesnt bother me if they want to try 3 or 4 different things during their time as long as they are respectful and dont violate my boundaries. After all I'm helping many fulfill fantasies and I'm already a nympho so if he would like to experiment with 5 different positions in his hour I'm game. There is a difference though if you demand that x, y and z be done and if not then you feel cheated and are disappointed because the session didnt go how ypu wanted. I wouldnt be doing this if I didn't enjoy sex and the excitement that comes with it. Another thing hobbyists quit being so shy and speak up. We read to much from yall saying you wanted this or she didnt do this with you and so on. We can't read minds and sometimes like you direct us alittle. If we ask you what you like tell us this is us trying to find out what you enjoy. Not answering us then getting pissed after a date because we didn't do something you wanted is not our fault.
Go into every session expecting a great time and just enjoy the experience. Don't go in with a long list of expectation and let things flow naturally. Speak up to your partner so you know what each other enjoys. Dont make things complicating or try to push boundaries. Keep things fun but also make sure both parties are on the same page that this is not going further than the time etc booked. Don't get emotional, dont catch feelings, dont try to save someone or convince someone they need saving. Once you step out of those boundaries you have forgotten the golden rule and you have now screwed shit up.
Totally respect your view too. I feel ya. Not snarky to me at all. I didn't mean toward you. I was just using the quote for the purpose of writing a response b/c in the past I have heard some really strange things. Even in the regular dating world there is truly bizarre shit guys do/say. Every bit as bizarre as what guys in hobby do. Same shit.
I mean the fact of the matter is we are all strangers to each other until we are not. That doesn't matter if it's an SO, a fuck buddy, or a provider. There is nothing mutually exclusive about those with respect to strangers. GFE, or even appearance of it (i.e. good IOP), likely won't happen unless you just have some good chemistry. Which happens. You cant count on it though. Hard to find it. The bottom line is good sex, actual good sex, requires good chemistry and attraction. Period. It does happen though. I know it does. In *all* categories. Examples: an xwife - sex on 1st encounter 1-2hrs after meeting otherwise we were complete total "strangers", hobby (certain provider - years ago), as well as a fuck buddy. The fact is in all of those cases we were strangers to each other until we were not. That's life.
I feel ya though. If you are gonna spend your money you want to know what you are gonna get. I was just saying guys could be a lot more polite about asking. That was my main thing really. Also I'd say you still risk the issue that even though she says she will do x, y, z (maybe she will) but she doesn't actually like you. For whatever reason. Not b/c you are not handsome, clean, polite, or whatever (or maybe those are issues, who knows). Maybe you just are not someone that she can be "GFE" with not even if it just means giving a nice "hobby GFE" IOP performance. That's why I'm so picky. It's not about their body or "menu" usually. I rarely see anyone. I post some now to entertain myself. I even posted some ISO's when I was really bored, late night, very horny. Nothing came of a single one of those posts. It's not because people didn't approach. I simply don't want to have sex with a person who has a bad attitude or doesn't find me at least somewhat attractive, cool, funny, whatever does it for them. The reason is for the same reason I quoted in a different thread. B/c I'm a dude and you could pay me a shit ton pile of money and I *still* would have some trouble really making it great for a woman if I just didn't like her attitude, her voice, her style, or for whatever reason if she is just not my type, attractive, blah blah.
Some people may think that's silly that I'm that picky about it. That's you're right. I don't give a fuck. I want what I want and I won't settle for less.
It's just my opinion that menu's, too much business like talk, rushing people around with 15 character limit txt msgs (like always), telling them "hurry up", make a decision I'm busy, etc... all reeks of someone who has no time (definitely no planning skills) b/c men are lined up at a skank motel, some of them probably waiting in their cars, where you can likely watch the previous guy walk out, and so on. No thank you. Nah. Not everyone does that. I don't need to go past stranger stage with someone like that (lol). Just like I don't need to go past stranger stage with a girl from OkCupid or that I met at the grocery store who ends up insulting me or my values at dinner, has a nasty attitude, or many other things I wouldn't be able to stand, or that may even repulse me. But I feel ya knottyman. I gotcha. No disrespect.
Oh ya, one other thing b/c it was mentioned somewhere on this thread (I think?). I disagree that you can't have true GFE with a hobby provider. I admit that it's pretty rare and hard to find and definitely not something a guy should "expect". Girls too. Like say a rich Brad Pitt type walks through the door I'm sure at least some of you hope for things (especially if you continue to see them). Come on. You are lying if you say never. Nah. I don't buy that. Anyway, on either side, there might be no chemistry or great attraction. Or maybe he just sees it how it is (which is just pay for play like BL said). However to say it doesn't happen is just absolutely incorrect. I know it does. I've been with a few people like I've said from all different areas of life: hobby, RL (gf/wives), fuck buddies, and most definitely they do as much or more activities and have no limits whatsoever (in my experiences - in those particular experiences). There wasn't a single thing my SO wouldn't do. If I can't get that then I want the very next best thing, which would be the a really good IOP version of GFE. And that's fine too as a a pay for play thing. However, this is why I rarely ever see anyone. B/c I know that's asking a lot. I'm cool with that though. To each his/her own.
Damn could someone give me the cliffs notes on this thread!! Jeez
Just read post #22. Brittany_love sums it up nicely.
P411 Verified.
Slow and sensual, I enjoy the road as much as the destination. Love lingerie, heels, dresses, massage, DFK & edging. I'm a finish Carpenter and handyman that loves to work with my hands.
Oh I busted out laughing at this^^^^^^^^^^too funny!
Yes, Brit summed it up nicely. I can tell by the initial communication if the gentleman and I will be compatible. It's the "tone" of the communication that alot of people don't understand or either don't get. I always say communication is the key to a successful relationship but it's the way you say it. The key to everything is - respect. Oh dear - now I have Aretha Franklin's song in my head!
So "whazz up baby"!!!!! doesn't do it for you?
DragonX
On hobby hiatus.
Ha!!!!!!
So "whazz up baby"!!!!! doesn't do it for you?
DragonX
Gotta luv that Motown sound.
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